| [ron h] Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:04:27 PM | |
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Oh, I do not disagree, but I'd like to think KK, Glenn, Ian and Binks had a little something to do with it as well...
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by spapad from Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:55:23 PM)| |  | spapad wrote: | | Hello Brother Ron! and Welcome to Metal church! HA!! Yes of course, that is what we are talking about, and i don't know, I kind of like Hellrider said about this in the first place. All would have been different if all facets of Rob's personality were not the same as he grew up being. (Quoting Message by ron h from Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:51:34 PM)
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ron h wrote: |
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| Well, at least the look of Metal... |
Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:00:48 PM
Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:01:31 PM |
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| [hellrider 31038] Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:03:13 PM | |
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"I think now, as far as image and identity are concerned, we've got the whole thing down pat and it's pretty solid. I don't think we'll ever really deviate to any degree from our physical presentation because you know how important it is to maintain a certain level of imagery, so that when people think of Rob Halford, or whomever else in the band, they instantly paint a mental picture of the way you are rather than just your music. They remember the whips and the motorbikes. The whole process of imagery now, I think, is important or even more important than it has been in the past. I think the identity side of it is crucial to a certain extent. Bands don't get anywhere if they're faceless. You can have the greatest sounding album in the world, but if people can't relate to an individual or to the group as a whole in their appearance, then the band isn't really getting anywhere."- Rob Halford, Heavy Metal Times, November 1982
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ron h from Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:51:34 PM)| | | ron h wrote: | | | Well, at least the look of Metal... |
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| [spapad] Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:55:23 PM | |
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Hello Brother Ron! and Welcome to Metal church! HA!! Yes of course, that is what we are talking about, and i don't know, I kind of like Hellrider said about this in the first place. All would have been different if all facets of Rob's personality were not the same as he grew up being. [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ron h from Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:51:34 PM)
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ron h wrote: |
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| Well, at least the look of Metal... |
Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:00:48 PM
Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:01:31 PM |
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| [ron h] Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:51:34 PM | |
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| Well, at least the look of Metal... |
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| [spapad] Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:50:35 PM | |
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[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by hellrider 31038 from Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:49:08 PM)| | | hellrider 31038 wrote: | | METAL WOULD NOT EXSIST WITHOUT THE METAL GOD sister spapad
| | | spapad wrote: | | AMEN! Brother Hellrider!   Can I get a witness!!!
| | | hellrider 31038 wrote: | | "That was another turning point for the band. Rob was very instrumental in laying down laws and codes for what heavy metal bands should wear at that point in time. The whole leather image stemmed from that era and now it's just accepted that's what goes with heavy metal. Up to that point, it was spandex and satin trousers, or even jeans and T-shirts."- Glenn Tipton, Heavy Duty official biography, 1984
in my opinion HEAVY MEEETTT TTTTAAAALLLLL would not exsist without the METAL GOD
| | | J.D. DIAMOND wrote: | | 
Yes spapad that is correct. Look at this picture of "Venom" from 1981 .....Venom created "black metal" and the members "Cronos,Abbadon and Mantis" are not gay,....
Cronos even said that he got his leather,studs and spikes image from "Rob Halford" and Judas Priest because they set the standard of what metal's image looked like.
It wasn't a trend and the other bands were not ripping Halford off,but that image fit for not only heavy metal...but for black metal and the true old school death metal bands as well.
The most abrasive bands in the extreme metal underground like old "Deicide", old "Morbid Angel" and "Mayhem" with Euronymous(r.i.p.)knew Rob was gay and didn't even
think long enough about it to give a rats! I've read articles where they mention Rob Halford as an influence that got them into metal in the first place. Its crazy to sit back and
look at what Rob created with heavy metal's image.....and still to this day...in my opinion studs,spikes,chains,denim & leather,bullet belts,pins on jackets,finger cut black gloves..ect....
all of these aesthetics are needed in heavy metal ....not that a band will be "good" just because they were the image,but without it...they really don't have a chance to continue the
..
true spirit of early Traditional British styled Heavy Metal ......I can't count the many times someone says : "Heres a heavy metal band for you to listen to"....and then I listen to it and
it doesn't sound heavy metalish.....and then I look at the band's photo and low and behold? Its a bunch of college frat rockers with baggy jungle pants the kind that the ass hangs down
and almost touches the floor...with a Hockey jersey on ( "nothing against hockey fans but it doesn't belong in metal" ) with a freaking "BASEBALL HAT" on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOFL!!!!!
And absolutely " NOTHING AGAINST PEOPLE WHO WEAR BASEBALL HATS"....its just that they don't belong in heavy metal's image. Bands that play a rock/and heavy metal seem to
be able to wear a mix between heavy metal and a rock image like Saxon...they play traditional heavy metal like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden but they also write "rock songs" and have always
said they are heavy metal/rock band.....Paul Quinn,one of the guitarists wears a baseball hat but usually wears a leather vest and ect.... Motorhead is a hard rock band and not a heavy metal band
so Lemmy's image has always been the same..... But Rob sure set the standards of heavy metal and its quite awsome on a massive scale how he himself not only wore the gay biker outfits but also
wore the total traditional heavy metal image. What a guy!!!!!!!!!
(Quoting Message by spapad from Wednesday, August 05, 2009 7:08:40 PM)
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spapad wrote: |
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Perhaps I missread, but to be honest, I don't find it to be of great importance. I do feel Rob influenced the whole look of metal by simply chosing the ruff boy gay look of the seventies to gear up priest, and Metal fans everywhere embrassed what was first a gay image and made it there own and to this day, if you see that much leather you know, you talking Metal. Fine by me! I love it!
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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In that case, my previous points still stand! If Priest were not in the media on those occasions purely because of Rob's sexuality, then they cant be used as examples of them being more known about purely because of that. Like I say, Ive only known of one occasion where Rob's sexuality has been specifically mentioned in the mainstream media. lol
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spapad wrote: |
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His sexuality was not the issue of them being in the mainstream media, it's the fact that JP are an incredible band.
They appeared on Jimmy Kimmel live last year, which was a late night talk show here. They are still in so many Metal Mags, Rolling Stone still covers them, they were up for what, two Grammys last year? I'd say they don't fly completly under the radar!
Thank God they are not covered in the way all media portrays half the celebrities in this world, talk about a dirty landryfest on the behalf of the media, it's disgusting to be so intrusive into anyone's life.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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Seeing as I live in the UK, I didnt know about that :P
Maybe it is different in the American mainstream media, but certainly in the UK, neither Rob, nor Priest are really any more in the media now, then before he came out. If it's different in the US, then I take back what I said in my previous post lol
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spapad wrote: |
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CNN ran it as a headline story when Rob and Priest reunited. I'd say that is about as mainstream as you can get.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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I think you overestimate the amount of people who only know about Priest through Rob's sexuality. I think very few people outside of the metal community have any idea about Judas Priest, let alone Rob's sexuality. Most outside of the metal community only know what the mainstream media feeds them, and I dont think Rob or Priest are much more in the mainstream media now, than before Rob came out of the closet. Maybe you have heard a lot about it in the mainstream media, but I certainly havent. I think one time a few years ago, I saw Graham Norton mention Rob on his show, but aside from that one time, I've yet to see Rob's sexuality mentioned in any mainstream media, outside of specifically metal publications. Im sure there are a tiny minority of people who know about Priest now, but wouldnt have if Rob wasnt gay. But to say its "a lot of people", I think is overestimating it.
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Yes, my friend. We do love him. And so do tens of thousands of people all around the world. I don't think there is any question that Rob Halford is respected and loved. That is true. I think what it really comes down to is, there are a lot of people that do not care for Metal and do not know his work but they DO know about his sexuality. You cannot ignore that. It makes a difference in so much as the number of human beings that are aware of the Band. It does make a difference.
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J.D. DIAMOND wrote: |
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Yes Freeze...I agree. There are a lot of people who don't know Judas Priest that well and connect the fact that "Isn't that the band with the gay guy singing"? They don't say that in a negative way ..
they are just trying to make that connection and some people may take that the wrong way,but the average person who asks this is not meaning any disrespect or what not.
If Rob were to log on this forum right now,he would be flattered that so many of us accept him for what he is...an "EQUAL" to each and every one of us. We love you Rob!!!!!!!
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Hmm.. I have tried to avoid commenting only because I detest yet ANOTHER moronic Thread but I suppose I will throw in my "two cents" on the subject...AGAIN.
YES. Rob's sexuality DOES make a difference! I have said that before and I hold to that position today. It is OH so chic to make flowery speeches about how "it doesn't matter" and "true fans don't care" and whatnot and, of course, to those of us that are TRUE fans, it doesn't. The fact remains, there is a HUGE number of people in this world that only know Priest because "they have that gay guy" singing for them. We have ALL heard that comment in some form.
The fact that Rob Halford is a gay man in a Heavy Metal band IS a big deal. It is noteworthy and it has brought them attention where they may never had received any. There is a large portion of people that know about the band because Rob is openly gay and THAT makes it part of the equation, regardless of whether or not one believes it "matters". Matters how??? Matters from a talent standpoint? No. From an ability standpoint? No. By saying "it does not matter", one is suggesting (I assume) that he still can sing. This is quite true. But the topic here is "Would Priest be more popular" if Rob were NOT gay. I believe the answer is, no. They would not be "more" popular. There would likely be no significant difference as far as popularity is concerned. Today's "popular" music is chock full of gay people.
I think the more appropriate comment would be that they would not be as well known be as many people. That seems like a safe bet. They will always have a fanbase. They will always have the achievements they have. Gay or straight, I doubt that would be affected. Popularity? Nah, I doubt that as well. Notoriety? THAT is a possibility. By this fact alone, it DOES make a difference.
Edited at: Wednesday, August 05, 2009 5:25:51 PM |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:41:12 AM |
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| [hellrider 31038] Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:49:08 PM | |
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METAL WOULD NOT EXSIST WITHOUT THE METAL GOD sister spapad
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by spapad from Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:41:26 PM)| | | spapad wrote: | | AMEN! Brother Hellrider! Can I get a witness!!!
| | | hellrider 31038 wrote: | | "That was another turning point for the band. Rob was very instrumental in laying down laws and codes for what heavy metal bands should wear at that point in time. The whole leather image stemmed from that era and now it's just accepted that's what goes with heavy metal. Up to that point, it was spandex and satin trousers, or even jeans and T-shirts."- Glenn Tipton, Heavy Duty official biography, 1984
in my opinion HEAVY MEEETTT TTTTAAAALLLLL would not exsist without the METAL GOD
| | | J.D. DIAMOND wrote: | |
Yes spapad that is correct. Look at this picture of "Venom" from 1981 .....Venom created "black metal" and the members "Cronos,Abbadon and Mantis" are not gay,....
Cronos even said that he got his leather,studs and spikes image from "Rob Halford" and Judas Priest because they set the standard of what metal's image looked like.
It wasn't a trend and the other bands were not ripping Halford off,but that image fit for not only heavy metal...but for black metal and the true old school death metal bands as well.
The most abrasive bands in the extreme metal underground like old "Deicide", old "Morbid Angel" and "Mayhem" with Euronymous(r.i.p.)knew Rob was gay and didn't even
think long enough about it to give a rats! I've read articles where they mention Rob Halford as an influence that got them into metal in the first place. Its crazy to sit back and
look at what Rob created with heavy metal's image.....and still to this day...in my opinion studs,spikes,chains,denim & leather,bullet belts,pins on jackets,finger cut black gloves..ect....
all of these aesthetics are needed in heavy metal ....not that a band will be "good" just because they were the image,but without it...they really don't have a chance to continue the
..
true spirit of early Traditional British styled Heavy Metal ......I can't count the many times someone says : "Heres a heavy metal band for you to listen to"....and then I listen to it and
it doesn't sound heavy metalish.....and then I look at the band's photo and low and behold? Its a bunch of college frat rockers with baggy jungle pants the kind that the ass hangs down
and almost touches the floor...with a Hockey jersey on ( "nothing against hockey fans but it doesn't belong in metal" ) with a freaking "BASEBALL HAT" on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOFL!!!!!
And absolutely " NOTHING AGAINST PEOPLE WHO WEAR BASEBALL HATS"....its just that they don't belong in heavy metal's image. Bands that play a rock/and heavy metal seem to
be able to wear a mix between heavy metal and a rock image like Saxon...they play traditional heavy metal like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden but they also write "rock songs" and have always
said they are heavy metal/rock band.....Paul Quinn,one of the guitarists wears a baseball hat but usually wears a leather vest and ect.... Motorhead is a hard rock band and not a heavy metal band
so Lemmy's image has always been the same..... But Rob sure set the standards of heavy metal and its quite awsome on a massive scale how he himself not only wore the gay biker outfits but also
wore the total traditional heavy metal image. What a guy!!!!!!!!!
(Quoting Message by spapad from Wednesday, August 05, 2009 7:08:40 PM)
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spapad wrote: |
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Perhaps I missread, but to be honest, I don't find it to be of great importance. I do feel Rob influenced the whole look of metal by simply chosing the ruff boy gay look of the seventies to gear up priest, and Metal fans everywhere embrassed what was first a gay image and made it there own and to this day, if you see that much leather you know, you talking Metal. Fine by me! I love it!
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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In that case, my previous points still stand! If Priest were not in the media on those occasions purely because of Rob's sexuality, then they cant be used as examples of them being more known about purely because of that. Like I say, Ive only known of one occasion where Rob's sexuality has been specifically mentioned in the mainstream media. lol
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spapad wrote: |
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His sexuality was not the issue of them being in the mainstream media, it's the fact that JP are an incredible band.
They appeared on Jimmy Kimmel live last year, which was a late night talk show here. They are still in so many Metal Mags, Rolling Stone still covers them, they were up for what, two Grammys last year? I'd say they don't fly completly under the radar!
Thank God they are not covered in the way all media portrays half the celebrities in this world, talk about a dirty landryfest on the behalf of the media, it's disgusting to be so intrusive into anyone's life.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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Seeing as I live in the UK, I didnt know about that :P
Maybe it is different in the American mainstream media, but certainly in the UK, neither Rob, nor Priest are really any more in the media now, then before he came out. If it's different in the US, then I take back what I said in my previous post lol
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spapad wrote: |
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CNN ran it as a headline story when Rob and Priest reunited. I'd say that is about as mainstream as you can get.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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I think you overestimate the amount of people who only know about Priest through Rob's sexuality. I think very few people outside of the metal community have any idea about Judas Priest, let alone Rob's sexuality. Most outside of the metal community only know what the mainstream media feeds them, and I dont think Rob or Priest are much more in the mainstream media now, than before Rob came out of the closet. Maybe you have heard a lot about it in the mainstream media, but I certainly havent. I think one time a few years ago, I saw Graham Norton mention Rob on his show, but aside from that one time, I've yet to see Rob's sexuality mentioned in any mainstream media, outside of specifically metal publications. Im sure there are a tiny minority of people who know about Priest now, but wouldnt have if Rob wasnt gay. But to say its "a lot of people", I think is overestimating it.
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Yes, my friend. We do love him. And so do tens of thousands of people all around the world. I don't think there is any question that Rob Halford is respected and loved. That is true. I think what it really comes down to is, there are a lot of people that do not care for Metal and do not know his work but they DO know about his sexuality. You cannot ignore that. It makes a difference in so much as the number of human beings that are aware of the Band. It does make a difference.
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J.D. DIAMOND wrote: |
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Yes Freeze...I agree. There are a lot of people who don't know Judas Priest that well and connect the fact that "Isn't that the band with the gay guy singing"? They don't say that in a negative way ..
they are just trying to make that connection and some people may take that the wrong way,but the average person who asks this is not meaning any disrespect or what not.
If Rob were to log on this forum right now,he would be flattered that so many of us accept him for what he is...an "EQUAL" to each and every one of us. We love you Rob!!!!!!!
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Hmm.. I have tried to avoid commenting only because I detest yet ANOTHER moronic Thread but I suppose I will throw in my "two cents" on the subject...AGAIN.
YES. Rob's sexuality DOES make a difference! I have said that before and I hold to that position today. It is OH so chic to make flowery speeches about how "it doesn't matter" and "true fans don't care" and whatnot and, of course, to those of us that are TRUE fans, it doesn't. The fact remains, there is a HUGE number of people in this world that only know Priest because "they have that gay guy" singing for them. We have ALL heard that comment in some form.
The fact that Rob Halford is a gay man in a Heavy Metal band IS a big deal. It is noteworthy and it has brought them attention where they may never had received any. There is a large portion of people that know about the band because Rob is openly gay and THAT makes it part of the equation, regardless of whether or not one believes it "matters". Matters how??? Matters from a talent standpoint? No. From an ability standpoint? No. By saying "it does not matter", one is suggesting (I assume) that he still can sing. This is quite true. But the topic here is "Would Priest be more popular" if Rob were NOT gay. I believe the answer is, no. They would not be "more" popular. There would likely be no significant difference as far as popularity is concerned. Today's "popular" music is chock full of gay people.
I think the more appropriate comment would be that they would not be as well known be as many people. That seems like a safe bet. They will always have a fanbase. They will always have the achievements they have. Gay or straight, I doubt that would be affected. Popularity? Nah, I doubt that as well. Notoriety? THAT is a possibility. By this fact alone, it DOES make a difference.
Edited at: Wednesday, August 05, 2009 5:25:51 PM |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:41:12 AM |
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| [spapad] Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:41:26 PM | |
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AMEN! Brother Hellrider! Can I get a witness!!!
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by hellrider 31038 from Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:36:30 PM)| | | hellrider 31038 wrote: | | "That was another turning point for the band. Rob was very instrumental in laying down laws and codes for what heavy metal bands should wear at that point in time. The whole leather image stemmed from that era and now it's just accepted that's what goes with heavy metal. Up to that point, it was spandex and satin trousers, or even jeans and T-shirts."- Glenn Tipton, Heavy Duty official biography, 1984
in my opinion HEAVY MEEETTT TTTTAAAALLLLL would not exsist without the METAL GOD
| | | J.D. DIAMOND wrote: | |
Yes spapad that is correct. Look at this picture of "Venom" from 1981 .....Venom created "black metal" and the members "Cronos,Abbadon and Mantis" are not gay,....
Cronos even said that he got his leather,studs and spikes image from "Rob Halford" and Judas Priest because they set the standard of what metal's image looked like.
It wasn't a trend and the other bands were not ripping Halford off,but that image fit for not only heavy metal...but for black metal and the true old school death metal bands as well.
The most abrasive bands in the extreme metal underground like old "Deicide", old "Morbid Angel" and "Mayhem" with Euronymous(r.i.p.)knew Rob was gay and didn't even
think long enough about it to give a rats! I've read articles where they mention Rob Halford as an influence that got them into metal in the first place. Its crazy to sit back and
look at what Rob created with heavy metal's image.....and still to this day...in my opinion studs,spikes,chains,denim & leather,bullet belts,pins on jackets,finger cut black gloves..ect....
all of these aesthetics are needed in heavy metal ....not that a band will be "good" just because they were the image,but without it...they really don't have a chance to continue the
..
true spirit of early Traditional British styled Heavy Metal ......I can't count the many times someone says : "Heres a heavy metal band for you to listen to"....and then I listen to it and
it doesn't sound heavy metalish.....and then I look at the band's photo and low and behold? Its a bunch of college frat rockers with baggy jungle pants the kind that the ass hangs down
and almost touches the floor...with a Hockey jersey on ( "nothing against hockey fans but it doesn't belong in metal" ) with a freaking "BASEBALL HAT" on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOFL!!!!!
And absolutely " NOTHING AGAINST PEOPLE WHO WEAR BASEBALL HATS"....its just that they don't belong in heavy metal's image. Bands that play a rock/and heavy metal seem to
be able to wear a mix between heavy metal and a rock image like Saxon...they play traditional heavy metal like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden but they also write "rock songs" and have always
said they are heavy metal/rock band.....Paul Quinn,one of the guitarists wears a baseball hat but usually wears a leather vest and ect.... Motorhead is a hard rock band and not a heavy metal band
so Lemmy's image has always been the same..... But Rob sure set the standards of heavy metal and its quite awsome on a massive scale how he himself not only wore the gay biker outfits but also
wore the total traditional heavy metal image. What a guy!!!!!!!!!
(Quoting Message by spapad from Wednesday, August 05, 2009 7:08:40 PM)
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spapad wrote: |
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Perhaps I missread, but to be honest, I don't find it to be of great importance. I do feel Rob influenced the whole look of metal by simply chosing the ruff boy gay look of the seventies to gear up priest, and Metal fans everywhere embrassed what was first a gay image and made it there own and to this day, if you see that much leather you know, you talking Metal. Fine by me! I love it!
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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In that case, my previous points still stand! If Priest were not in the media on those occasions purely because of Rob's sexuality, then they cant be used as examples of them being more known about purely because of that. Like I say, Ive only known of one occasion where Rob's sexuality has been specifically mentioned in the mainstream media. lol
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spapad wrote: |
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His sexuality was not the issue of them being in the mainstream media, it's the fact that JP are an incredible band.
They appeared on Jimmy Kimmel live last year, which was a late night talk show here. They are still in so many Metal Mags, Rolling Stone still covers them, they were up for what, two Grammys last year? I'd say they don't fly completly under the radar!
Thank God they are not covered in the way all media portrays half the celebrities in this world, talk about a dirty landryfest on the behalf of the media, it's disgusting to be so intrusive into anyone's life.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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Seeing as I live in the UK, I didnt know about that :P
Maybe it is different in the American mainstream media, but certainly in the UK, neither Rob, nor Priest are really any more in the media now, then before he came out. If it's different in the US, then I take back what I said in my previous post lol
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spapad wrote: |
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CNN ran it as a headline story when Rob and Priest reunited. I'd say that is about as mainstream as you can get.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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I think you overestimate the amount of people who only know about Priest through Rob's sexuality. I think very few people outside of the metal community have any idea about Judas Priest, let alone Rob's sexuality. Most outside of the metal community only know what the mainstream media feeds them, and I dont think Rob or Priest are much more in the mainstream media now, than before Rob came out of the closet. Maybe you have heard a lot about it in the mainstream media, but I certainly havent. I think one time a few years ago, I saw Graham Norton mention Rob on his show, but aside from that one time, I've yet to see Rob's sexuality mentioned in any mainstream media, outside of specifically metal publications. Im sure there are a tiny minority of people who know about Priest now, but wouldnt have if Rob wasnt gay. But to say its "a lot of people", I think is overestimating it.
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Yes, my friend. We do love him. And so do tens of thousands of people all around the world. I don't think there is any question that Rob Halford is respected and loved. That is true. I think what it really comes down to is, there are a lot of people that do not care for Metal and do not know his work but they DO know about his sexuality. You cannot ignore that. It makes a difference in so much as the number of human beings that are aware of the Band. It does make a difference.
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J.D. DIAMOND wrote: |
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Yes Freeze...I agree. There are a lot of people who don't know Judas Priest that well and connect the fact that "Isn't that the band with the gay guy singing"? They don't say that in a negative way ..
they are just trying to make that connection and some people may take that the wrong way,but the average person who asks this is not meaning any disrespect or what not.
If Rob were to log on this forum right now,he would be flattered that so many of us accept him for what he is...an "EQUAL" to each and every one of us. We love you Rob!!!!!!!
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Hmm.. I have tried to avoid commenting only because I detest yet ANOTHER moronic Thread but I suppose I will throw in my "two cents" on the subject...AGAIN.
YES. Rob's sexuality DOES make a difference! I have said that before and I hold to that position today. It is OH so chic to make flowery speeches about how "it doesn't matter" and "true fans don't care" and whatnot and, of course, to those of us that are TRUE fans, it doesn't. The fact remains, there is a HUGE number of people in this world that only know Priest because "they have that gay guy" singing for them. We have ALL heard that comment in some form.
The fact that Rob Halford is a gay man in a Heavy Metal band IS a big deal. It is noteworthy and it has brought them attention where they may never had received any. There is a large portion of people that know about the band because Rob is openly gay and THAT makes it part of the equation, regardless of whether or not one believes it "matters". Matters how??? Matters from a talent standpoint? No. From an ability standpoint? No. By saying "it does not matter", one is suggesting (I assume) that he still can sing. This is quite true. But the topic here is "Would Priest be more popular" if Rob were NOT gay. I believe the answer is, no. They would not be "more" popular. There would likely be no significant difference as far as popularity is concerned. Today's "popular" music is chock full of gay people.
I think the more appropriate comment would be that they would not be as well known be as many people. That seems like a safe bet. They will always have a fanbase. They will always have the achievements they have. Gay or straight, I doubt that would be affected. Popularity? Nah, I doubt that as well. Notoriety? THAT is a possibility. By this fact alone, it DOES make a difference.
Edited at: Wednesday, August 05, 2009 5:25:51 PM |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:41:12 AM |
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| [hellrider 31038] Thursday, August 06, 2009 6:36:30 PM | |
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"That was another turning point for the band. Rob was very instrumental in laying down laws and codes for what heavy metal bands should wear at that point in time. The whole leather image stemmed from that era and now it's just accepted that's what goes with heavy metal. Up to that point, it was spandex and satin trousers, or even jeans and T-shirts."- Glenn Tipton, Heavy Duty official biography, 1984
in my opinion HEAVY MEEETTT TTTTAAAALLLLL would not exsist without the METAL GOD
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by J.D. DIAMOND from Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:23:20 AM)| | | J.D. DIAMOND wrote: | |
Yes spapad that is correct. Look at this picture of "Venom" from 1981 .....Venom created "black metal" and the members "Cronos,Abbadon and Mantis" are not gay,....
Cronos even said that he got his leather,studs and spikes image from "Rob Halford" and Judas Priest because they set the standard of what metal's image looked like.
It wasn't a trend and the other bands were not ripping Halford off,but that image fit for not only heavy metal...but for black metal and the true old school death metal bands as well.
The most abrasive bands in the extreme metal underground like old "Deicide", old "Morbid Angel" and "Mayhem" with Euronymous(r.i.p.)knew Rob was gay and didn't even
think long enough about it to give a rats! I've read articles where they mention Rob Halford as an influence that got them into metal in the first place. Its crazy to sit back and
look at what Rob created with heavy metal's image.....and still to this day...in my opinion studs,spikes,chains,denim & leather,bullet belts,pins on jackets,finger cut black gloves..ect....
all of these aesthetics are needed in heavy metal ....not that a band will be "good" just because they were the image,but without it...they really don't have a chance to continue the
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true spirit of early Traditional British styled Heavy Metal ......I can't count the many times someone says : "Heres a heavy metal band for you to listen to"....and then I listen to it and
it doesn't sound heavy metalish.....and then I look at the band's photo and low and behold? Its a bunch of college frat rockers with baggy jungle pants the kind that the ass hangs down
and almost touches the floor...with a Hockey jersey on ( "nothing against hockey fans but it doesn't belong in metal" ) with a freaking "BASEBALL HAT" on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOFL!!!!!
And absolutely " NOTHING AGAINST PEOPLE WHO WEAR BASEBALL HATS"....its just that they don't belong in heavy metal's image. Bands that play a rock/and heavy metal seem to
be able to wear a mix between heavy metal and a rock image like Saxon...they play traditional heavy metal like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden but they also write "rock songs" and have always
said they are heavy metal/rock band.....Paul Quinn,one of the guitarists wears a baseball hat but usually wears a leather vest and ect.... Motorhead is a hard rock band and not a heavy metal band
so Lemmy's image has always been the same..... But Rob sure set the standards of heavy metal and its quite awsome on a massive scale how he himself not only wore the gay biker outfits but also
wore the total traditional heavy metal image. What a guy!!!!!!!!!
(Quoting Message by spapad from Wednesday, August 05, 2009 7:08:40 PM)
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spapad wrote: |
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Perhaps I missread, but to be honest, I don't find it to be of great importance. I do feel Rob influenced the whole look of metal by simply chosing the ruff boy gay look of the seventies to gear up priest, and Metal fans everywhere embrassed what was first a gay image and made it there own and to this day, if you see that much leather you know, you talking Metal. Fine by me! I love it!
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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In that case, my previous points still stand! If Priest were not in the media on those occasions purely because of Rob's sexuality, then they cant be used as examples of them being more known about purely because of that. Like I say, Ive only known of one occasion where Rob's sexuality has been specifically mentioned in the mainstream media. lol
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spapad wrote: |
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His sexuality was not the issue of them being in the mainstream media, it's the fact that JP are an incredible band.
They appeared on Jimmy Kimmel live last year, which was a late night talk show here. They are still in so many Metal Mags, Rolling Stone still covers them, they were up for what, two Grammys last year? I'd say they don't fly completly under the radar!
Thank God they are not covered in the way all media portrays half the celebrities in this world, talk about a dirty landryfest on the behalf of the media, it's disgusting to be so intrusive into anyone's life.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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Seeing as I live in the UK, I didnt know about that :P
Maybe it is different in the American mainstream media, but certainly in the UK, neither Rob, nor Priest are really any more in the media now, then before he came out. If it's different in the US, then I take back what I said in my previous post lol
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spapad wrote: |
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CNN ran it as a headline story when Rob and Priest reunited. I'd say that is about as mainstream as you can get.
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Angelic Storm wrote: |
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I think you overestimate the amount of people who only know about Priest through Rob's sexuality. I think very few people outside of the metal community have any idea about Judas Priest, let alone Rob's sexuality. Most outside of the metal community only know what the mainstream media feeds them, and I dont think Rob or Priest are much more in the mainstream media now, than before Rob came out of the closet. Maybe you have heard a lot about it in the mainstream media, but I certainly havent. I think one time a few years ago, I saw Graham Norton mention Rob on his show, but aside from that one time, I've yet to see Rob's sexuality mentioned in any mainstream media, outside of specifically metal publications. Im sure there are a tiny minority of people who know about Priest now, but wouldnt have if Rob wasnt gay. But to say its "a lot of people", I think is overestimating it.
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Yes, my friend. We do love him. And so do tens of thousands of people all around the world. I don't think there is any question that Rob Halford is respected and loved. That is true. I think what it really comes down to is, there are a lot of people that do not care for Metal and do not know his work but they DO know about his sexuality. You cannot ignore that. It makes a difference in so much as the number of human beings that are aware of the Band. It does make a difference.
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J.D. DIAMOND wrote: |
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Yes Freeze...I agree. There are a lot of people who don't know Judas Priest that well and connect the fact that "Isn't that the band with the gay guy singing"? They don't say that in a negative way ..
they are just trying to make that connection and some people may take that the wrong way,but the average person who asks this is not meaning any disrespect or what not.
If Rob were to log on this forum right now,he would be flattered that so many of us accept him for what he is...an "EQUAL" to each and every one of us. We love you Rob!!!!!!!
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Deep Freeze wrote: |
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Hmm.. I have tried to avoid commenting only because I detest yet ANOTHER moronic Thread but I suppose I will throw in my "two cents" on the subject...AGAIN.
YES. Rob's sexuality DOES make a difference! I have said that before and I hold to that position today. It is OH so chic to make flowery speeches about how "it doesn't matter" and "true fans don't care" and whatnot and, of course, to those of us that are TRUE fans, it doesn't. The fact remains, there is a HUGE number of people in this world that only know Priest because "they have that gay guy" singing for them. We have ALL heard that comment in some form.
The fact that Rob Halford is a gay man in a Heavy Metal band IS a big deal. It is noteworthy and it has brought them attention where they may never had received any. There is a large portion of people that know about the band because Rob is openly gay and THAT makes it part of the equation, regardless of whether or not one believes it "matters". Matters how??? Matters from a talent standpoint? No. From an ability standpoint? No. By saying "it does not matter", one is suggesting (I assume) that he still can sing. This is quite true. But the topic here is "Would Priest be more popular" if Rob were NOT gay. I believe the answer is, no. They would not be "more" popular. There would likely be no significant difference as far as popularity is concerned. Today's "popular" music is chock full of gay people.
I think the more appropriate comment would be that they would not be as well known be as many people. That seems like a safe bet. They will always have a fanbase. They will always have the achievements they have. Gay or straight, I doubt that would be affected. Popularity? Nah, I doubt that as well. Notoriety? THAT is a possibility. By this fact alone, it DOES make a difference.
Edited at: Wednesday, August 05, 2009 5:25:51 PM |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:41:12 AM |
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| [J.D. DIAMOND] Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:40:29 PM | |
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I can put on 100 albums on random play and be able to name the song,the album its from,the year the album was released and how many songs on that album as well! lol!
I have a great memory....not bad from someone thats been smoking pot for 25 years!!! lofl Head banger!!!!! lol!
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Head banger from Thursday, August 06, 2009 2:25:06 PM)| | | Head banger wrote: | | yeah, I like them, but when I have music on random, I cant tell you what disc it came from. except for most of somewhere in time.
that one I know better cause it is the only maiden I had for a long time.
| | | Bev wrote: | | I understand your point.
I've never been an IronMaiden fan. I like a couple of songs, but because there is redundancy to their style of writing, I find them boring.
(Quoting Message by Head banger from Thursday, August 06, 2009 12:07:51 PM)
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Head banger wrote: |
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I dont know the technical terms either (are most priest fans more musicaly knowledgable than fans of other bands?)
I do notice a marked change in style with british steel, and again with painkiller. then of course rob left....
its actualy not the converting the casual I think that is the problem, its getting the casual fan to begin with. how many maiden "fans" are there that cant name half the CD's they have put out, and own edward the great and one other. priest doesnt have those "fans"
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Bev wrote: |
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| IDK HB ... though they push the musical boundaries the music can be associated with them (wish I could use the appropriate technical terms), but it is definitely distinguishable; the guitar style, tone, etc is KK & Glenn, vocals definitely Rob / Ripper. 'Has something to do with production but if you know the sound you recognize the band. Sorry, don't know how better to describe it. I think it's been up to the diehards to Baptize the casual! If they don't convert, well that is on us - lol |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:03:34 PM |
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| [J.D. DIAMOND] Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:37:31 PM | |
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I agree metalmaz.....I've seen many so-called "die-hard-fans" of Priest when really they are a casual fan....I ask them about albums or songs and they can't even name all thier albums!
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by metalmaz from Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:56:52 PM)| | | metalmaz wrote: | | I think most people who attend concerts whether it be Priest or Maiden or Metallica or whoever tend to be casual rather than die hard fans. A lot of them won't have every single release by them and I reckon most of them have never been near the JP forum either.
I bet if you did a straw poll many people in a Priest concert wouldn't be able to name all their releases as well. And does it matter? If you put a ban on them because "they are not real fans" Priest would be playing to unfilled veneus.
(Quoting Message by Head banger from Thursday, August 06, 2009 12:07:51 PM)
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Head banger wrote: |
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I dont know the technical terms either (are most priest fans more musicaly knowledgable than fans of other bands?)
I do notice a marked change in style with british steel, and again with painkiller. then of course rob left....
its actualy not the converting the casual I think that is the problem, its getting the casual fan to begin with. how many maiden "fans" are there that cant name half the CD's they have put out, and own edward the great and one other. priest doesnt have those "fans"
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Bev wrote: |
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| IDK HB ... though they push the musical boundaries the music can be associated with them (wish I could use the appropriate technical terms), but it is definitely distinguishable; the guitar style, tone, etc is KK & Glenn, vocals definitely Rob / Ripper. 'Has something to do with production but if you know the sound you recognize the band. Sorry, don't know how better to describe it. I think it's been up to the diehards to Baptize the casual! If they don't convert, well that is on us - lol |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:58:12 PM |
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| [Head banger] Thursday, August 06, 2009 2:25:06 PM | |
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yeah, I like them, but when I have music on random, I cant tell you what disc it came from. except for most of somewhere in time.
that one I know better cause it is the only maiden I had for a long time.
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Bev from Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:02:13 PM)| | | Bev wrote: | | I understand your point.
I've never been an IronMaiden fan. I like a couple of songs, but because there is redundancy to their style of writing, I find them boring.
(Quoting Message by Head banger from Thursday, August 06, 2009 12:07:51 PM)
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Head banger wrote: |
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I dont know the technical terms either (are most priest fans more musicaly knowledgable than fans of other bands?)
I do notice a marked change in style with british steel, and again with painkiller. then of course rob left....
its actualy not the converting the casual I think that is the problem, its getting the casual fan to begin with. how many maiden "fans" are there that cant name half the CD's they have put out, and own edward the great and one other. priest doesnt have those "fans"
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Bev wrote: |
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| IDK HB ... though they push the musical boundaries the music can be associated with them (wish I could use the appropriate technical terms), but it is definitely distinguishable; the guitar style, tone, etc is KK & Glenn, vocals definitely Rob / Ripper. 'Has something to do with production but if you know the sound you recognize the band. Sorry, don't know how better to describe it. I think it's been up to the diehards to Baptize the casual! If they don't convert, well that is on us - lol |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:03:34 PM |
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| [metalmaz] Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:56:52 PM | |
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I think most people who attend concerts whether it be Priest or Maiden or Metallica or whoever tend to be casual rather than die hard fans. A lot of them won't have every single release by them and I reckon most of them have never been near the JP forum either.
I bet if you did a straw poll many people in a Priest concert wouldn't be able to name all their releases as well. And does it matter? If you put a ban on them because "they are not real fans" Priest would be playing to unfilled veneus.
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Head banger from Thursday, August 06, 2009 12:07:51 PM)
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Head banger wrote: |
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I dont know the technical terms either (are most priest fans more musicaly knowledgable than fans of other bands?)
I do notice a marked change in style with british steel, and again with painkiller. then of course rob left....
its actualy not the converting the casual I think that is the problem, its getting the casual fan to begin with. how many maiden "fans" are there that cant name half the CD's they have put out, and own edward the great and one other. priest doesnt have those "fans"
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Bev wrote: |
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| IDK HB ... though they push the musical boundaries the music can be associated with them (wish I could use the appropriate technical terms), but it is definitely distinguishable; the guitar style, tone, etc is KK & Glenn, vocals definitely Rob / Ripper. 'Has something to do with production but if you know the sound you recognize the band. Sorry, don't know how better to describe it. I think it's been up to the diehards to Baptize the casual! If they don't convert, well that is on us - lol |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:58:12 PM |
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| [Bev] Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:02:13 PM | |
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I understand your point.
I've never been an IronMaiden fan. I like a couple of songs, but because there is redundancy to their style of writing, I find them boring.
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Head banger from Thursday, August 06, 2009 12:07:51 PM)
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Head banger wrote: |
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I dont know the technical terms either (are most priest fans more musicaly knowledgable than fans of other bands?)
I do notice a marked change in style with british steel, and again with painkiller. then of course rob left....
its actualy not the converting the casual I think that is the problem, its getting the casual fan to begin with. how many maiden "fans" are there that cant name half the CD's they have put out, and own edward the great and one other. priest doesnt have those "fans"
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Bev wrote: |
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| IDK HB ... though they push the musical boundaries the music can be associated with them (wish I could use the appropriate technical terms), but it is definitely distinguishable; the guitar style, tone, etc is KK & Glenn, vocals definitely Rob / Ripper. 'Has something to do with production but if you know the sound you recognize the band. Sorry, don't know how better to describe it. I think it's been up to the diehards to Baptize the casual! If they don't convert, well that is on us - lol |
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Edited at: Thursday, August 06, 2009 1:03:34 PM |
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| [Head banger] Thursday, August 06, 2009 12:07:51 PM | |
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I dont know the technical terms either (are most priest fans more musicaly knowledgable than fans of other bands?)
I do notice a marked change in style with british steel, and again with painkiller. then of course rob left....
its actualy not the converting the casual I think that is the problem, its getting the casual fan to begin with. how many maiden "fans" are there that cant name half the CD's they have put out, and own edward the great and one other. priest doesnt have those "fans"
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Bev from Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:21:15 AM)| | | Bev wrote: | | | IDK HB ... though they push the musical boundaries the music can be associated with them (wish I could use the appropriate technical terms), but it is definitely distinguishable; the guitar style, tone, etc is KK & Glenn, vocals definitely Rob / Ripper. 'Has something to do with production but if you know the sound you recognize the band. Sorry, don't know how better to describe it. I think it's been up to the diehards to Baptize the casual! If they don't convert, well that is on us - lol |
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| [metalmaz] Thursday, August 06, 2009 11:46:54 AM | |
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Or appearing on that show (called the X Factor in England and American Idol in the USA). What is the name of that idiot who foisted this garbage on us. Simon something or other.
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Deep Freeze from Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:18:52 AM)| | | Deep Freeze wrote: | | Ah yes! The voice of reason! HAAAAAAAAAA! Actually, I do not think the "popularity" would be affected much (outside of the fanbase) because if you look at what passes for "popular" music today, it is the finished "product" that is LEAST important!! From what I see, all you need is a synthesizer on your mic, a pre-recorded drumbeat, a few dancers writhing around behind you and some cheap dance moves and you are a "popular" artist. Hardly much of a MUSICAL product involved at all.
| | | Bev wrote: | | | ... at the end of the day, would it not be the music (the finished product) that determines the band's popularity? Only a thought to include lively discussion ; ) |
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| [Bev] Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:27:49 AM | |
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[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Deep Freeze from Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:26:31 AM)| | | Deep Freeze wrote: | | Well said, Bev. I suppose it IS "on us". I carry the torch as best I can around this place. I still cannot believe my step son WANTS to go to the gig Saturday!!! I was STUNNED when he was actually EXCITED about the tickets!! Just goes to show that we MUST remain vigilant!!! They WILL come to us....they will come....come.....
BWAAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| [Deep Freeze] Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:26:31 AM | |
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Well said, Bev. I suppose it IS "on us". I carry the torch as best I can around this place. I still cannot believe my step son WANTS to go to the gig Saturday!!! I was STUNNED when he was actually EXCITED about the tickets!! Just goes to show that we MUST remain vigilant!!! They WILL come to us....they will come....come.....
BWAAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| [Bev] Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:22:26 AM | |
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HA!!!
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Deep Freeze from Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:18:52 AM)| | | Deep Freeze wrote: | | Ah yes! The voice of reason! HAAAAAAAAAA! Actually, I do not think the "popularity" would be affected much (outside of the fanbase) because if you look at what passes for "popular" music today, it is the finished "product" that is LEAST important!! From what I see, all you need is a synthesizer on your mic, a pre-recorded drumbeat, a few dancers writhing around behind you and some cheap dance moves and you are a "popular" artist. Hardly much of a MUSICAL product involved at all.
| | | Bev wrote: | | | ... at the end of the day, would it not be the music (the finished product) that determines the band's popularity? Only a thought to include lively discussion ; ) |
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| [Bev] Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:21:15 AM | |
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| IDK HB ... though they push the musical boundaries the music can be associated with them (wish I could use the appropriate technical terms), but it is definitely distinguishable; the guitar style, tone, etc is KK & Glenn, vocals definitely Rob / Ripper. 'Has something to do with production but if you know the sound you recognize the band. Sorry, don't know how better to describe it. I think it's been up to the diehards to Baptize the casual! If they don't convert, well that is on us - lol |
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| [Deep Freeze] Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:18:52 AM | |
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Ah yes! The voice of reason! HAAAAAAAAAA! Actually, I do not think the "popularity" would be affected much (outside of the fanbase) because if you look at what passes for "popular" music today, it is the finished "product" that is LEAST important!! From what I see, all you need is a synthesizer on your mic, a pre-recorded drumbeat, a few dancers writhing around behind you and some cheap dance moves and you are a "popular" artist. Hardly much of a MUSICAL product involved at all.
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Bev from Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:10:38 AM)| | | Bev wrote: | | | ... at the end of the day, would it not be the music (the finished product) that determines the band's popularity? Only a thought to include lively discussion ; ) |
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