The woes of the world will never end bacause sadly, we run it. The human race is fallable and therefore never truly learns. I think we need a baby sitter. lol [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by guidogodoy from Monday, April 12, 2010 6:07:35 PM)
guidogodoy wrote:
"El sueño de la razón produce monstruos" = The sleep of reason produces monsters.
"Desastres (aka. Atrocidades) de guerra" - Disasters of war. Both, Francisco de Goya.
jimmyjames wrote:
Good to see the human race has learned a lot isn't it.
guidogodoy wrote:
Currently. At the time, Spain was all by its lonesome. Menaced by the rest of what we now call "Europe," in fact, as hyperinflation hit, then dictatorships, etc.
Bad moves on both parts would be my conclusion. Both now and then. I fear for the future.
jimmyjames wrote:
It is. Except it doesn't have the benefit of being part of Europe. The rest of Africa's a mess too.
guidogodoy wrote:
Hmmm...sounds very much like Spain c. 1492. Expulsion of the Jews that were the basis of the economy and the Moors who were the traders.
They were once a world power and have been trying to recover ever since.
jimmyjames wrote:
What I hate about the South African situation is that the government is basically advocating the slaughter of the people that keep the countrys infrastructure going. Once the whites in the country leave or are killed things will deteriorate and all that will be left will be millions of aids stricken, uneducated, starving tribal peoples ruled by a "government" which is actually nothing more than a dictatorship propped up by the military. See Rhodesia. Thing is no-one outside can do anything about it. Some of the stuff going on there makes the mind boggle.
[guidogodoy] Monday, April 12, 2010 6:07:35 PM
"El sueño de la razón produce monstruos" = The sleep of reason produces monsters.
"Desastres (aka. Atrocidades) de guerra" - Disasters of war. Both, Francisco de Goya.
Good to see the human race has learned a lot isn't it.
guidogodoy wrote:
Currently. At the time, Spain was all by its lonesome. Menaced by the rest of what we now call "Europe," in fact, as hyperinflation hit, then dictatorships, etc.
Bad moves on both parts would be my conclusion. Both now and then. I fear for the future.
jimmyjames wrote:
It is. Except it doesn't have the benefit of being part of Europe. The rest of Africa's a mess too.
guidogodoy wrote:
Hmmm...sounds very much like Spain c. 1492. Expulsion of the Jews that were the basis of the economy and the Moors who were the traders.
They were once a world power and have been trying to recover ever since.
jimmyjames wrote:
What I hate about the South African situation is that the government is basically advocating the slaughter of the people that keep the countrys infrastructure going. Once the whites in the country leave or are killed things will deteriorate and all that will be left will be millions of aids stricken, uneducated, starving tribal peoples ruled by a "government" which is actually nothing more than a dictatorship propped up by the military. See Rhodesia. Thing is no-one outside can do anything about it. Some of the stuff going on there makes the mind boggle.
[jimmyjames] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:57:44 PM
Good to see the human race has learned a lot isn't it. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by guidogodoy from Monday, April 12, 2010 5:51:38 PM)
guidogodoy wrote:
Currently. At the time, Spain was all by its lonesome. Menaced by the rest of what we now call "Europe," in fact, as hyperinflation hit, then dictatorships, etc.
Bad moves on both parts would be my conclusion. Both now and then. I fear for the future.
jimmyjames wrote:
It is. Except it doesn't have the benefit of being part of Europe. The rest of Africa's a mess too.
guidogodoy wrote:
Hmmm...sounds very much like Spain c. 1492. Expulsion of the Jews that were the basis of the economy and the Moors who were the traders.
They were once a world power and have been trying to recover ever since.
jimmyjames wrote:
What I hate about the South African situation is that the government is basically advocating the slaughter of the people that keep the countrys infrastructure going. Once the whites in the country leave or are killed things will deteriorate and all that will be left will be millions of aids stricken, uneducated, starving tribal peoples ruled by a "government" which is actually nothing more than a dictatorship propped up by the military. See Rhodesia. Thing is no-one outside can do anything about it. Some of the stuff going on there makes the mind boggle.
[guidogodoy] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:51:38 PM
Currently. At the time, Spain was all by its lonesome. Menaced by the rest of what we now call "Europe," in fact, as hyperinflation hit, then dictatorships, etc.
Bad moves on both parts would be my conclusion. Both now and then. I fear for the future. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by jimmyjames from Monday, April 12, 2010 5:48:18 PM)
jimmyjames wrote:
It is. Except it doesn't have the benefit of being part of Europe. The rest of Africa's a mess too.
guidogodoy wrote:
Hmmm...sounds very much like Spain c. 1492. Expulsion of the Jews that were the basis of the economy and the Moors who were the traders.
They were once a world power and have been trying to recover ever since.
jimmyjames wrote:
What I hate about the South African situation is that the government is basically advocating the slaughter of the people that keep the countrys infrastructure going. Once the whites in the country leave or are killed things will deteriorate and all that will be left will be millions of aids stricken, uneducated, starving tribal peoples ruled by a "government" which is actually nothing more than a dictatorship propped up by the military. See Rhodesia. Thing is no-one outside can do anything about it. Some of the stuff going on there makes the mind boggle.
[jimmyjames] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:48:18 PM
It is. Except it doesn't have the benefit of being part of Europe. The rest of Africa's a mess too.
Hmmm...sounds very much like Spain c. 1492. Expulsion of the Jews that were the basis of the economy and the Moors who were the traders.
They were once a world power and have been trying to recover ever since.
jimmyjames wrote:
What I hate about the South African situation is that the government is basically advocating the slaughter of the people that keep the countrys infrastructure going. Once the whites in the country leave or are killed things will deteriorate and all that will be left will be millions of aids stricken, uneducated, starving tribal peoples ruled by a "government" which is actually nothing more than a dictatorship propped up by the military. See Rhodesia. Thing is no-one outside can do anything about it. Some of the stuff going on there makes the mind boggle.
[guidogodoy] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:43:43 PM
Hmmm...sounds very much like Spain c. 1492. Expulsion of the Jews that were the basis of the economy and the Moors who were the traders.
They were once a world power and have been trying to recover ever since. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by jimmyjames from Monday, April 12, 2010 5:21:27 PM)
jimmyjames wrote:
What I hate about the South African situation is that the government is basically advocating the slaughter of the people that keep the countrys infrastructure going. Once the whites in the country leave or are killed things will deteriorate and all that will be left will be millions of aids stricken, uneducated, starving tribal peoples ruled by a "government" which is actually nothing more than a dictatorship propped up by the military. See Rhodesia. Thing is no-one outside can do anything about it. Some of the stuff going on there makes the mind boggle.
[jimmyjames] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:21:27 PM
What I hate about the South African situation is that the government is basically advocating the slaughter of the people that keep the countrys infrastructure going. Once the whites in the country leave or are killed things will deteriorate and all that will be left will be millions of aids stricken, uneducated, starving tribal peoples ruled by a "government" which is actually nothing more than a dictatorship propped up by the military. See Rhodesia. Thing is no-one outside can do anything about it. Some of the stuff going on there makes the mind boggle.
Oh no, I wasn't suggesting that's what you meant, I was just putting my opinion forward
Head banger wrote:
I am not saying forget it, I am saying acknowledge, learn from and move on. forgetting would be a huge mistake, but at some point we have to say that we cant fix it, sorry for the actions years ago wont work and move on.
Becks wrote:
Personally, I think that the past should absolutely be acknowledged and not forgotten. But in order to move forward, we can't live in the past. It holds us back from any sort of progress. But I know it's much much more complicated than that.
Head banger wrote:
The thing is, there has been mistreatment in the past, but how do you make up for that today? afirmitive action? reverse racism? give money? what realy needs to happen is everyone to move on. wont happen though. lots use past wrongs as an excuse.
[Becks] Monday, April 12, 2010 12:26:31 PM
Oh no, I wasn't suggesting that's what you meant, I was just putting my opinion forward [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by Head banger from Monday, April 12, 2010 5:27:25 AM)
Head banger wrote:
I am not saying forget it, I am saying acknowledge, learn from and move on. forgetting would be a huge mistake, but at some point we have to say that we cant fix it, sorry for the actions years ago wont work and move on.
Becks wrote:
Personally, I think that the past should absolutely be acknowledged and not forgotten. But in order to move forward, we can't live in the past. It holds us back from any sort of progress. But I know it's much much more complicated than that.
Head banger wrote:
The thing is, there has been mistreatment in the past, but how do you make up for that today? afirmitive action? reverse racism? give money? what realy needs to happen is everyone to move on. wont happen though. lots use past wrongs as an excuse.
[Deep Freeze] Monday, April 12, 2010 6:03:21 AM
I was really trying to come to grips with an appropriate response to all of this. It's very difficult for me. To begin with, I really LIKE Craig. He's a good egg. I am not all that sure he is a "racist". He has an opinion, however misguided it may be.
I am old enough to remember the Watts Riots as well. I lived through the Civil Rights Movement of the 60's and I remember it. I have often said that I am not an "oppressed" black man so it is really beyond me to try to think as one. I have never been denied anything due to my color. I do not know what it is like to live in such a manner. Having acknowledged all of this, I must say that I agree with Guido completely. To paint all people of color with the same brush by suggesting that they are violent by nature is simply ignorant.
The environment in which one lives has much to do with one's behavior. There are good and bad in all peoples. In all countries. I have never been to Africa, Somalia, the Congo or any other "black" country. I have NO idea what life is like there. I do know that people are people and things like slavery were not invented by white people. Man has enslaved his brother since time began. It is sickening and sad and a blemish on ALL humankind. I also know that I, personally, have never owned another person (black or otherwise). Neither did my father, grandfather or great grandfather. I am fairly confident that I had NOTHING to do with oppressing blacks and, therefore, I feel no particular guilt nor debt to them. They are just people like me.
We cannot change what was. We can only make our little part of "now" as good as it can be. We also cannot change what others do. There are scum among us and it will always be so. Murderers, rapists, child molestors, Brian Evans impostors, etc. They are the filth of the world and will be here long after we have gone.
[Head banger] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:31:37 AM
Hate is easy but wrong. to do the right thing is always harder on both sides. thats why its rare. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by joedraper from Monday, April 12, 2010 1:15:26 AM)
joedraper wrote:
The last thing I wanted to do with this discussion was turn it around into hate speach. The reason things are like they are today is very much due to hatred and intolerance of each other. The black people in our country did have a shit deal for many, many years before I was even born. What I am going on about now is how after the democratic voting took place and apartheid was abolished in 1990, things have gotten worse. We live in an overpopulated world with imorral fat cats in leadership positions. Our current president was charged with corruption and rape (found not guilty), has multi wives and has just fathered his 20th child in a poverty stricken country? He (andf Julias) live in the lap of luxury while so many otheres starve.
If these so called leaders would not let gread and their own hedonism go into overdrive, there would be enough food/clothing/housing for so many more. Education is power but they make it impossible for lower class peoole to attend school while they go on shopping trips to Dubai and drive cars that are in the million rands price range (why?)
I am one of the lucky ones I guess, I have a nice home, food and can educate my children. Not many can say the same. I just wish that like Spa said earlier, people would stop focusing on past events and move the hell on. We have the potential to be so much more. Killing just because you don't like someone's skin colour will never be right.. on either side of the spectrum. I'm not hateful toward any race, I just feel very threatened being a white female in this country where we are on the brink of a race war because of ignorant people in power singing songs to starving black people validating the murder and rape of white people.
That is what I was on about!
Please to anyone reading this. It was never about hate!
The last thing I want to be portrayed as is something I haved fought against my entire life here.. a racist.. I am certainly not a racist and I despise racists.
Craig Wagenhoffer wrote:
I've lived in Los Angeles all my life and I can tell you this: black people are born troublemakers. It's something in their blood. They like to raise hell and cause destruction. The males especially. Check out this video of the LA riots in '92. It's mind boggling:
I know what I'm talking about, because I was there during the spring of 1992, when all hell broke loose.
The Africans are making a mess out of it and the whites just don't care. That's because we have lost every sense of community, patriotism and self-respect. We do not stand united. We do not help eachother out. Today individualism reigns supreme. We don't give a shit. We are being brainwashed by the liberal media.
The situation is taking a turn for the worse in South Africa and in the US. Europe will soon follow. The European continent is being flooded by african muslims as we speak. They are usurpers. The native Europeans are to become a minority on their own continent. Countries like France and the UK have the power to increase their native population if they want but the politicians who are in charge obviously don't care.
This is what a former African leader said in 1974:
"One day millions of men will leave the southern hemisphere to go to the northern hemisphere. And they will not go there as friends. Because they will go there to conquer it with their sons. The wombs of our women will give us victory."
Here's another interesting quote by an infamous African leader:
"There are 50 million muslims in Europe as we speak. The 50 million muslims of Europe will turn it into a muslim continent within a few decades." Edited at: Sunday, April 11, 2010 7:38:10 AM
[Head banger] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:27:25 AM
I am not saying forget it, I am saying acknowledge, learn from and move on. forgetting would be a huge mistake, but at some point we have to say that we cant fix it, sorry for the actions years ago wont work and move on. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by Becks from Sunday, April 11, 2010 9:13:15 PM)
Becks wrote:
Personally, I think that the past should absolutely be acknowledged and not forgotten. But in order to move forward, we can't live in the past. It holds us back from any sort of progress. But I know it's much much more complicated than that.
Head banger wrote:
The thing is, there has been mistreatment in the past, but how do you make up for that today? afirmitive action? reverse racism? give money? what realy needs to happen is everyone to move on. wont happen though. lots use past wrongs as an excuse.
[Budred] Monday, April 12, 2010 5:02:55 AM
Remember my post about intolerance. This is exactly what I was talking about. I feel so bad about Joe's situation
and I so commend her for her last post. To endure what she has to and still speak out against racism shows what kind of person she is. I have nothing but respect for her. I so wish the world could follow. I can't pray but I hope and
wish nothing but the best for Joe and her family. Show support all, she deserves it. Peace!
I do feel for Joe and her situation and being forced to leave a home that she belongs to is injust. But Mr. Craig's post was not about that. He took this conversation and used it to his own means of hate speech. That is pathetic. There are many reasons for what has happened over the years in America and in other countries, but sadly it all comes down to hate being taught to a generation of beings, and passed along down the line. This is the poison that will kill us all.
jimmyjames wrote:
Not sure what the situations like in the States. But I do think more peoples views would be in line with Craigs if you had been there too. Seeing that kind of thing happen is going to change your perspective for sure. It's not preaching hate, it's an opinion, that's all.
The thing is the LA riots is nothing compared to what's going on in South Africa. The blacks are out of control, it's like sharks at a feeding frenzy. Johannesburg, I think, is the most violent city in the world. When Joe says she fears for her family etc. She literally fears they could be killed at any time. That stuff happens there all the time.
[joedraper] Monday, April 12, 2010 1:15:26 AM
The last thing I wanted to do with this discussion was turn it around into hate speach. The reason things are like they are today is very much due to hatred and intolerance of each other. The black people in our country did have a shit deal for many, many years before I was even born. What I am going on about now is how after the democratic voting took place and apartheid was abolished in 1990, things have gotten worse. We live in an overpopulated world with imorral fat cats in leadership positions. Our current president was charged with corruption and rape (found not guilty), has multi wives and has just fathered his 20th child in a poverty stricken country? He (andf Julias) live in the lap of luxury while so many otheres starve.
If these so called leaders would not let gread and their own hedonism go into overdrive, there would be enough food/clothing/housing for so many more. Education is power but they make it impossible for lower class peoole to attend school while they go on shopping trips to Dubai and drive cars that are in the million rands price range (why?)
I am one of the lucky ones I guess, I have a nice home, food and can educate my children. Not many can say the same. I just wish that like Spa said earlier, people would stop focusing on past events and move the hell on. We have the potential to be so much more. Killing just because you don't like someone's skin colour will never be right.. on either side of the spectrum. I'm not hateful toward any race, I just feel very threatened being a white female in this country where we are on the brink of a race war because of ignorant people in power singing songs to starving black people validating the murder and rape of white people.
That is what I was on about!
Please to anyone reading this. It was never about hate!
The last thing I want to be portrayed as is something I haved fought against my entire life here.. a racist.. I am certainly not a racist and I despise racists.
I've lived in Los Angeles all my life and I can tell you this: black people are born troublemakers. It's something in their blood. They like to raise hell and cause destruction. The males especially. Check out this video of the LA riots in '92. It's mind boggling:
I know what I'm talking about, because I was there during the spring of 1992, when all hell broke loose.
The Africans are making a mess out of it and the whites just don't care. That's because we have lost every sense of community, patriotism and self-respect. We do not stand united. We do not help eachother out. Today individualism reigns supreme. We don't give a shit. We are being brainwashed by the liberal media.
The situation is taking a turn for the worse in South Africa and in the US. Europe will soon follow. The European continent is being flooded by african muslims as we speak. They are usurpers. The native Europeans are to become a minority on their own continent. Countries like France and the UK have the power to increase their native population if they want but the politicians who are in charge obviously don't care.
This is what a former African leader said in 1974:
"One day millions of men will leave the southern hemisphere to go to the northern hemisphere. And they will not go there as friends. Because they will go there to conquer it with their sons. The wombs of our women will give us victory."
Here's another interesting quote by an infamous African leader:
"There are 50 million muslims in Europe as we speak. The 50 million muslims of Europe will turn it into a muslim continent within a few decades." Edited at: Sunday, April 11, 2010 7:38:10 AM
[Becks] Sunday, April 11, 2010 9:13:15 PM
Personally, I think that the past should absolutely be acknowledged and not forgotten. But in order to move forward, we can't live in the past. It holds us back from any sort of progress. But I know it's much much more complicated than that. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by Head banger from Sunday, April 11, 2010 8:03:34 PM)
Head banger wrote:
The thing is, there has been mistreatment in the past, but how do you make up for that today? afirmitive action? reverse racism? give money? what realy needs to happen is everyone to move on. wont happen though. lots use past wrongs as an excuse.
[Head banger] Sunday, April 11, 2010 8:03:34 PM
The thing is, there has been mistreatment in the past, but how do you make up for that today? afirmitive action? reverse racism? give money? what realy needs to happen is everyone to move on. wont happen though. lots use past wrongs as an excuse.
[Becks] Sunday, April 11, 2010 7:39:36 PM
Totally agree Spa. Hate speech is how all sorts of problems start. Look at Mein Kampf. I have zero tolerance for hateful people who spout racist/facist/nasty bullshit. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by spapad from Sunday, April 11, 2010 12:56:03 PM)
spapad wrote:
Your post is offensive. Giving hate speech an outlet anywhere in this world should not be tolorated.
Craig Wagenhoffer wrote:
I've lived in Los Angeles all my life and I can tell you this: black people are born troublemakers. It's something in their blood. They like to raise hell and cause destruction. The males especially. Check out this video of the LA riots in '92. It's mind boggling:
I know what I'm talking about, because I was there during the spring of 1992, when all hell broke loose.
The Africans are making a mess out of it and the whites just don't care. That's because we have lost every sense of community, patriotism and self-respect. We do not stand united. We do not help eachother out. Today individualism reigns supreme. We don't give a shit. We are being brainwashed by the liberal media.
The situation is taking a turn for the worse in South Africa and in the US. Europe will soon follow. The European continent is being flooded by african muslims as we speak. They are usurpers. The native Europeans are to become a minority on their own continent. Countries like France and the UK have the power to increase their native population if they want but the politicians who are in charge obviously don't care.
This is what a former African leader said in 1974:
"One day millions of men will leave the southern hemisphere to go to the northern hemisphere. And they will not go there as friends. Because they will go there to conquer it with their sons. The wombs of our women will give us victory."
Here's another interesting quote by an infamous African leader:
"There are 50 million muslims in Europe as we speak. The 50 million muslims of Europe will turn it into a muslim continent within a few decades." Edited at: Sunday, April 11, 2010 7:38:10 AM
[spapad] Sunday, April 11, 2010 3:55:00 PM
I do feel for Joe and her situation and being forced to leave a home that she belongs to is injust. But Mr. Craig's post was not about that. He took this conversation and used it to his own means of hate speech. That is pathetic. There are many reasons for what has happened over the years in America and in other countries, but sadly it all comes down to hate being taught to a generation of beings, and passed along down the line. This is the poison that will kill us all. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by jimmyjames from Sunday, April 11, 2010 2:40:22 PM)
jimmyjames wrote:
Not sure what the situations like in the States. But I do think more peoples views would be in line with Craigs if you had been there too. Seeing that kind of thing happen is going to change your perspective for sure. It's not preaching hate, it's an opinion, that's all.
The thing is the LA riots is nothing compared to what's going on in South Africa. The blacks are out of control, it's like sharks at a feeding frenzy. Johannesburg, I think, is the most violent city in the world. When Joe says she fears for her family etc. She literally fears they could be killed at any time. That stuff happens there all the time.
[guidogodoy] Sunday, April 11, 2010 3:19:22 PM
Dude, if you know your history, there were also MASSIVE race riots in Detroit in 1967. It spread out to other poor cities in Michigan and most of it was, IMO, the direct result of many years of white on black oppression. Like you, I cannot fathom what is going on in another country (especially S. Africa at the moment) but I can speak about what I know.
I also lived through the time Craig described in his little hate speech. Sorry, I don't think it anything BUT a hate speech. Pay close attention to the video. Many went to the aid of the white people being attacked. It was described again and again in the news about how certain "people of color" went out to do the right thing and defend their fellow Man irrespective of their color.
Craig seems to step over a little white problem called SLAVERY. Segregation followed for years and, still, he blames blacks (not just African-Americans as many ARE Africans) as having some sort of "hate gene." Sorry, don't buy it nor do I like such racist remarks and, yes, they couldn't be more racist.
I do agree, as I have said, that there is nothing I could imagine to even begin to understand the problems of South Africa. Of course it is worse than the race riots here. Then again, go back not too many years and the KKK was alive and well doing everything and anything they wanted to the blacks in this country.
Hatred is not an innate trait to ANY culture / race / religion in my humble opinion. [Show/Hide Quoted Message](Quoting Message by jimmyjames from Sunday, April 11, 2010 2:40:22 PM)
jimmyjames wrote:
Not sure what the situations like in the States. But I do think more peoples views would be in line with Craigs if you had been there too. Seeing that kind of thing happen is going to change your perspective for sure. It's not preaching hate, it's an opinion, that's all.
The thing is the LA riots is nothing compared to what's going on in South Africa. The blacks are out of control, it's like sharks at a feeding frenzy. Johannesburg, I think, is the most violent city in the world. When Joe says she fears for her family etc. She literally fears they could be killed at any time. That stuff happens there all the time.
[jimmyjames] Sunday, April 11, 2010 2:40:22 PM
Not sure what the situations like in the States. But I do think more peoples views would be in line with Craigs if you had been there too. Seeing that kind of thing happen is going to change your perspective for sure. It's not preaching hate, it's an opinion, that's all.
The thing is the LA riots is nothing compared to what's going on in South Africa. The blacks are out of control, it's like sharks at a feeding frenzy. Johannesburg, I think, is the most violent city in the world. When Joe says she fears for her family etc. She literally fears they could be killed at any time. That stuff happens there all the time.
